Feedback Wanted on PC Tools Together Translation Process - Stage 2

[jrickard]

Hello,

We have a rough outline of how translation will work so that you can contribute towards ThreatFire being available in your native language. This is a work in progress so any suggestions you may have will be greatly appreciated.

Roles

Translator -This will be the standard role someone gets when they sign up. This will allow them to translate and to suggest alternatives (improve) translations that have already been submitted

Reviewer -Translators that have proven themselves will be promoted giving them the ability to approve Translators submissions as well as the standard Translator permissions.

Process

Those wishing to translate will use an interface that gives them the text from the product, one sentence at a time. By doing it this way, you can translate just one string or hundreds in a session depending on how much time you have. You can quit at any time and continue later with no loss of work.

This system also allows multiple contributors to work at the same time in a collaborative way without interfering with each other.

The already translated strings stay open for review/improvement so if you don't agree with someone else's translation, you can suggest your own.

When a given language gets to 100%, we will allow some time for contributors to review and then release a language pack. We won't close it to further review, the idea being that the translations should continue to improve over time. If improved, an updated language pack would be released.

Contributions would be acknowledged throughout!!!

What do you think?

[saner]

The process looks good, I want to mention one thing though.

I think it is quite important to be able to understand exactly where the phrases are shown in the application. For example, "edit" can be translated into Turkish as both "düzen" and "düzenle". One of them is a noun and the other is a verb. Of course, since the translated application will be tested thoroughly this may not be a major problem but a note section for each string would ease translators' jobs greatly.

[jrickard]

Saner -Thanks for that feedback.

Do you see a screenshot of where it appears (maybe a thumbnail that brings a larger view in a popup when clicked) as being more valuable than a line of English text explaining the term or just as valuable?

There are some issues about load times when introducing this type of thing but we want to experiment with it if you guys see a value in it.

[saner]

At first I thought a screenshot would be the best option, but it will be a burden on the people who create this system, so I decided it isn't so vital. I have participated in translations with only a few lines of text explanations and it was also understandable.

In the end, screenshots would make things a bit easier for us than it would be with explanations. Anyway, I won't oppose if you say that you can supply screenshots. :)

[jrickard]

At first I thought a screenshot would be the best option, but it will be a burden on the people who create this system, so I decided it isn't so vital. I have participated in translations with only a few lines of text explanations and it was also understandable.

In the end, screenshots would make things a bit easier for us than it would be with explanations. Anyway, I won't oppose if you say that you can supply screenshots. :)

I would say not to worry about the burden. We will weigh that against the benefit (We are looking into some cool automated ways to serve the screenshots up which will make it easier).

It is helpful though to know though, that some English context would be helpful at the very least.

Thanks

Keep the feedback coming!

[mjq424]

Hi
I definitely like the two-level approach in translation and review. I assume those who are not native speakers could have some input into something like placement of text (if it doesn't fit in the program window, etc)?

[jrickard]

Hi
I definitely like the two-level approach in translation and review. I assume those who are not native speakers could have some input into something like placement of text (if it doesn't fit in the program window, etc)?

QA will be a future item we would love to incorporate. We won't have the ability to generate screenshots on the fly with the new translation (Although its a really cool idea).

We could, however, make the language packs available for testing purposes at any time in their creation. It would mean at first that people doing that type of testing would need to post screenshots of the issue in the forum. - Becky, Daniel, and Charles are going to support any changes required (Thanks again guys!) so we don't have severe clipping issues or wraparound once the lang pack is made available.

That's a great addition that I hadn't thought of.

Thanks

[mjq424]

Hi
Something else I just remembered is also checking to see if user screen-DPI has an effect on text in the window, as I know this has been a problem previously.

[BDubrow]

if user screen-DPI has an effect on text in the window

This is definitely something that we'd want to keep an eye on as we expand to other languages. Generally we do try to plan for this, so if the localized text fits well in the UI (on a button or screen, etc.) then it should be okay regardless of DPI.

But certainly please let us know if you come across any instances (now or in future) where this is a problem!

Thanks,

[flamer0n]

Hi,
Features mentioned above, seem pretty cool.

I would like to have a feature to know how it's going to fit the translated text in a specific control (length of text), 'cause I'm sure the length of translated text, can be longer or shorter than original text. Shorter: no problem, but longer than control can display: problem.

Will there be something that PREVIEWs the text translated in ThreatFire or anything else that simulates TF GUI at original size (so the text won't violate the bounds of a control in gui)?

[jrickard]

Hi,
Features mentioned above, seem pretty cool.

I would like to have a feature to know how it's going to fit the translated text in a specific control (length of text), 'cause I'm sure the length of translated text, can be longer or shorter than original text. Shorter: no problem, but longer than control can display: problem.


Actually we never thought of prequalification as a way to prevent excessive QA after the translations are complete. The timeline on implementing something like that will depend heavily on what is already in place. I will discuss with Becky and Daniel to see if we track string length and then look at how we might "assign" that to the individual strings as a guide.

Of course, we would still want to accept translations that are too long because its better to be 100% correct then change it just to fit layout. At least this type of system would flag the discrepancies for the Development team.

Good stuff!



Will there be something that PREVIEWs the text translated in ThreatFire or anything else that simulates TF GUI at original size (so the text won't violate the bounds of a control in gui)?

This isn't possible in real time (it would be really cool so if the technology allows at some point we would try it out) but instead its more likely that QA would be facilitated as a separate task within the application.

[RavenMacDaddy]

For some unknown reason my account has been banned for a long time, so I'm frankly very lost on the PC Tools Together process by now. :D Jason, could you tell me or send me anything about the translation process of TF if we've come so far - I would gladly help out.

[jrickard]

For some unknown reason my account has been banned for a long time, so I'm frankly very lost on the PC Tools Together process by now. :D Rickard, could you tell me or send me anything about the translation process of TF if we've come so far - I would gladly help out.

Raven -

Glad to hear you weren't actually banned (I think that's what your note meant). If you ever have any issues in the future feel free to Direct Message me on Twitter (http://www.twitter.com/pctoolstogether) or email me at jrickard@pctools.com

We are still very much on schedule for end of May and as you can see with this thread are collecting feedback on what we have proposed so far.

You should also have a PM from me that went out to the 14 Beta participants we have so far (If you didn't get it, just let me know and I can resend it).

I will be sending out another PM later today.

To anyone else reading this that wants to get involved (There are some more things going on behind the scenes for Beta participants) - You can volunteer here:
http://www.pctools.com/forum/showthread.php?t=56298

[jrickard]

I would like to have a feature to know how it's going to fit the translated text in a specific control (length of text), 'cause I'm sure the length of translated text, can be longer or shorter than original text. Shorter: no problem, but longer than control can display: problem.

flamer0n -
This now looks to be possible but will require a bit of prep work. Although it might not make the May release, I have added it to our list of nice to have features on our roadmap.

Thanks for all the suggestions and we will be posting for more feedback as we make progress.

Feel free to keep commenting (It doesn't have to be limited to translation of UI if you have other ideas for this type of application)

[saad alfraanah]

hello
I wish from you to consider the rule of Arabic language
which is written from right to left .
I main to opposite it to make the Arabic language suitable with the programm Interface . :)

[jrickard]

hello
I wish from you to consider the rule of Arabic language
which is written from right to left .
I main to opposite it to make the Arabic language suitable with the programm Interface . :)

Saad,

Would having the ability to write right to left in the input box (translation box) be what you are after?

If so, that will definitely be a feature.

[Reodor]

When going through the translation it would be an advantage to have a 'next' tab going to the next item to translate. As now it jumps back to the first not yet translated 'word'. This leads to some jumping around in the menue system. It might some times be quicker to take the 'easy' ones first, then go back again. As it may not always be possible to do a 'word by word' translation, a bit of thoughts might be needed.

[jrickard]

When going through the translation it would be an advantage to have a 'next' tab going to the next item to translate. As now it jumps back to the first not yet translated 'word'. This leads to some jumping around in the menue system. It might some times be quicker to take the 'easy' ones first, then go back again. As it may not always be possible to do a 'word by word' translation, a bit of thoughts might be needed.

Reodor - So in the following example:

Untranslated Line 1
Untranslated Line 2
Untranslated Line 3
Untranslated Line 4

If you used View Translations to translate "Untranslated Line 3", you would like it to go to "Untranslated Line 4" when you hit next, not "Untranslated Line 1" like it does now?

PS. We are very close on the Virtual Keyboard so you should be able to continue translating before the end of the week.

Thanks