View Full Version : "Smart Updates" are Killing Me!
Well, I can now say with 100% certainty that my lockup problems are being caused by something in smart update. I was working on my PC late last night, when all of a sudden, I see a SD popup show up that says smart update needs to reboot to take effect. Arrrgh! Fearing a lockup from this unexpected update (SD went out and did this one on its own; it wasn't scheduled) I quickly saved my Word doc and yup, she locked up tight.
After the requisite power cycle, I checked the new SD stats:
Product Version: 5.0.0.185
Database Version: 5.07311
Intelli-Sigs: 441,803
Not only a new DB version, but build 185 of the product as well. Luckilly, I lost very little of my doc.
OK, so I keep working. I didn't realize that eventually, I hit my normally scheduled update time until I got another popup that says smart update ran again. Another quick save in Word and another lockup. After the power cycle, I now have:
Product Version: 5.0.0.185
Database Version: 5.07311
Intelli-Sigs: 441,975
So, this time, only a few more intelli-sigs; nothing more. But still, I got a lockup. Lost a little more of my doc this time, but nothing huge.
This is the third time in the last week and a half that I have been sitting in front of my machine working when I received a lockup immediately after a smart update, so I am convinced it is the culprit at this point.
So now, I have removed the smart update scheduled task and set up smart update to always prompt me prior to installing a new update. So hopefully, I won't get any more unexpected lockups, but of course the problem is I now realize that I can't perform an update without getting a lockup, which makes keeping up to date on things really tough.
Anthony - you may want to have the developers focus on the smart update part of the product to find this problem - it's definately in there somewhere. And obviously, build 185 hasn't helped any.
Since I started a new thread on this (my lockup posts were getting too spread out in various places), here are my system stats just for completeness:
Dell Inspiron 5150 Pentium 4; 3 GHz; 1.25 GB RAM; Window XP Pro
Zone Alarm Security Suite 7 (antivirus and antispyware disabled)
Norton SystemWorks 2007 (antivirus enabled)
Spyware Doctor 5, build 185 (antivirus not installed)
Rottie
05-18-2007, 05:22 PM
Hello ajm
Look at the thread "my computer freeze". I contacted support and they gave me an answer to avoid your computer locks up. Hopefully it is temporarily
Hello ajm
Look at the thread "my computer freeze". I contacted support and they gave me an answer to avoid your computer locks up. Hopefully it is temporarily
Good to know that works. But, I really don't want to have to restart in Safe Mode every time a new update comes out. That will probably actually take more time to do than the power cycles after a lockup. Now granted, it's less harsh on my machine, and I won't risk losing data, but still... a Safe Mode reboot isn't exactly speedy. Especially since you have to restart a second time to get back to normal operating mode.
It's definately a workable temporary band-aid, but I sure hope an actual fix comes out soon, because these lockups have been occuring ever since I updated to SD 5. Now that I know they are related to smart updates, let's hope that SD development can home in on this problem.
Hammer
05-18-2007, 06:45 PM
Automatic Smart Update locking up is one of the reported issues (see the "sticky"). The temporary solution until the fix is released is, under General Settings, to set "Smart Update action" to "Do not check for updates".
Automatic Smart Update locking up is one of the reported issues (see the "sticky"). The temporary solution until the fix is released is, under General Settings, to set "Smart Update action" to "Do not check for updates".
It is? I couldn't find it. What topic/thread are you referring to? I saw one in which auto smart update just fails, but nothing about it locking up machines.
ratchet
05-18-2007, 09:10 PM
Yes, it crashed my XP Pro at work yesterday, so I uninstalled it! Actually, it never crashed it before like it did my XP Home personal pc, only slowed it down from day one, so I figured it was good to go and then yesterday out of the blue... wam! Fortunately I didn't have to get IT.
Jinih
05-18-2007, 11:48 PM
well I also have the same problem. But the only difference is that when SD ver 185 is performing an auto update, it will make my other application become "Not responding". But after a couple of second (approx 30 sec) all is well. But I have learn my lesson. I have disable the auto update options in SD. Also if you perform the update daily, I don't think I'll need SD to seach update automatically.
Hammer
05-19-2007, 04:48 PM
ajm,
I found the thread, or at least one of them, that talks about automatic Smart Updates failing and suggests doing only manual updates.
http://www.pctools.com/forum/showthread.php?t=46639
ajm,
I found the thread, or at least one of them, that talks about automatic Smart Updates failing and suggests doing only manual updates.
http://www.pctools.com/forum/showthread.php?t=46639
Yeah, I saw that thread, but I don't think it's the same problem as I am having. However, I got rid of my auto smart updates and set SD to just notify me when an update is ready. I am waiting for another one to get released so I can try it manually to see what happens then. The updates were coming fast and furious for a few days there; now, nothing for 3 days, so I haven't been able to test manual updates yet.
Chippa
05-22-2007, 12:11 AM
The automatic smart update problem has been fixed in sdv5.0.0.186. Check that link. Hopefully this fixes your problem ajm. :)
Goodluck
Chippa
The automatic smart update problem has been fixed in sdv5.0.0.186. Check that link. Hopefully this fixes your problem ajm. :)
Goodluck
Chippa
Well, I just ran a manual smart update to update to build 186, and that also locked up my system. It said it required a reboot, so I let it do that. I had to kill off zlclient.exe (Zone Alarm), explorer.exe, and taskmgr.exe (which was running at the time). After a few minutes, it eventually reached the Windows dialog that says "Saving your settings...". The reboot hung at this point (I waited for about 10 minutes and it never got past that point).
So, I don't know if 186 solves anything for me yet. I guess I can't quite say it doesn't work, because technically, it wasn't completely installed at the time of this lockup because the reboot wasn't completed. Well, after a power cycle, I now have build 186, so we shall see what happens now.
Oh great! A couple of minutes after I power cycle my machine to "fix" yet another lockup, now I get a prompt from Zone Alarm that says PC Tools Smart Update is trying to access the Internet. Hmmm, I sure hope it isn't trying to kick off another update 10 minutes after the previous one! Actually, it shouldn't be, because I have it set to prompt me.
(by the way, when I set SD to prompt me for updates, I expected to see a popup when one was available. I have seen nothing like that. It wasn't until I manually brought up SD's main window that I saw an update was available. That isn't much of a "prompt!")
Anyway, I am about to tell ZA to allow the access. Hopefully, I won't see another lockup in a couple of minutes!
OK, nothing bad happened. No update was done. It must have just been SD going out and listening for updates or something. Which makes sense, 'cause the ZA popup said the program had changed (which of course it had) so I guess that's why I saw the popup.
I guess now, I have to just wait for the next update to see what happens.
Well, I just ran the latest update (w/ build 186 installed) and did not experience a system lockup when it was done! This is the first time since I installed SD 5 that I can say that. I am not quite ready to call this fixed, because this is the first time I have done a manual update that did not require a reboot (the last update needed a reboot due to the update to 186, and all previous updates were auto updates) so it is possible that this scenario has been working all the time, since it has been stated that auto updates weren't working, but manual ones were.
But, this is still a big step. I guess the next thing to try is to re-enable auto updates and see what happens. I am cautiously optimistic.
king_g
05-23-2007, 11:36 PM
The auto update issue has been fixed in the latest build, so hopefully your problem is resolved along with it.
Granger
Well, I thought my lockups were a thing of the past, but with the latest one, I once again got a hung machine. I still had it set to do a manual update, and the only thing that updated was the database. My machine was OK for a minute or two, but then locked up tight. So, I guess I just go lucky the last time around. Come to think of it, I did get one other update in the last couple of weeks that did not cause a lockup. No clue why; perhaps there was something "different" about the two updates that didn't cause a lockup.
I have been maintaining a log with the version numbers of all my updates over the last couple of weeks, along with what did and did not cause a lockup; perhaps someone in support could use that info to determine what is causing these problems.
In any case, build 186 still hasn't solved my problems. I guess I will have to try updating in safe mode, which I really don't want to have to do, but I don't see any other choice at this point.
c_edge
05-25-2007, 03:54 AM
Hey ajm,
If the updates are working ok in safemode, then another application is interferring with the SD updates causing your pc to lock up. It will be very difficult to figure out the cause as it could be any one of your apps running in the background.
The instructions below may help you to find out the cause, as you can try to find the likely cause of the conflict, but could be quite tedious to try, as sometimes you get the lockup and sometimes you dont. So you could accidentally miss the cause altogether. Just providing the instructions incase you have some time to run through the test.
Try this:
Start the computer with no programs running
To clean boot Windows XP with a Selective Startup
- Click on Start Menu > Run > Type: msconfig > OK
- The The System Configuration Utility appears
- Click on General Tab > Under Selective Startup, make sure that "Load System Services" is the only item checked. (You will be unable to unselect "Use Original BOOT.INI." This is OK).
- Clearing all the boxes (except Load System Services) provides for a basic clean boot. For a complete clean boot
- Click the Services tab.
- Check Hide All Microsoft Services (You must hide the Microsoft Services before continuing)
- Uncheck all Services which are displayed in the list except for the 2 Spyware Doctor services
- Click Apply and then OK.
- Click Restart
When the computer restarts, run Spyware Doctor and try to perform the Smart Update
To restore your computer to its original settings
1. Click Start, and then click Run. The Run window appears.
2. In the Open box, type msconfig and then click OK. The System Configuration Utility appears.
3. Click Normal Startup.
4. Click OK.
5. Click Restart.
Goodluck!!!
c_edge :D
Rottie
05-27-2007, 09:50 AM
Well, I just ran the latest update (w/ build 186 installed) and did not experience a system lockup when it was done! This is the first time since I installed SD 5 that I can say that. I am not quite ready to call this fixed, because this is the first time I have done a manual update that did not require a reboot (the last update needed a reboot due to the update to 186, and all previous updates were auto updates) so it is possible that this scenario has been working all the time, since it has been stated that auto updates weren't working, but manual ones were.
But, this is still a big step. I guess the next thing to try is to re-enable auto updates and see what happens. I am cautiously optimistic.
My computer still lock up when I do "smart update" manually, but when I swich to auto smart update I have no problems with SD w. AV updates.
c_edge
05-28-2007, 04:58 AM
My computer still lock up when I do "smart update" manually, but when I swich to auto smart update I have no problems with SD w. AV updates.
This is quite bizzare. Sd users were experiencing the complete opposite, where manual updates work and a problem with the auto updates, but this has since been fixed with the latest build. I am trying to figure out why you can auto update but not manual, but no idea.
c_edge
Rottie
05-28-2007, 09:26 AM
This is quite bizzare. Sd users were experiencing the complete opposite, where manual updates work and a problem with the auto updates, but this has since been fixed with the latest build. I am trying to figure out why you can auto update but not manual, but no idea.
c_edge
Hello c_edge
I can manual smart update my SD but when it is finished my computer lock up - a problem I have had with both auto and manual smart update previously.
After the latest SD update I still have problem with manual smart update lock up after it is finished but it does not happen when I tried auto smart update.
So I just let SD update by it self.
It should be said that I run Vista Premium
Hey ajm,
If the updates are working ok in safemode, then another application is interferring with the SD updates causing your pc to lock up. It will be very difficult to figure out the cause as it could be any one of your apps running in the background.
. . .
Try this:
Start the computer with no programs running
. . . [deleted for brevity] . . .
c_edge :D
Yeah, that sounds like pretty much the same procedure I had to go through to get Norton SystemWorks 2007 to work.
On a hunch, I am going to attempt something a bit less drastic. I have an update waiting to install, and before I do so, I am going to disable Zone Alarm and Norton SystemWorks (I guess I will have to turn on Windows Firewall for the short term) and then run the Smart Update and see what happens. These are the 2 most likely apps that could be conflicting with SD; I also have SpySweeper's service still chugging along even though I disabled that app awhile ago (my lockups occurred long before SS was ever installed, so that ain't it; I suppose I should just uninstall SS completely).
If this test doesn't do anything, then maybe I will try your complete test.
Now that I know my lockups occur right after a Smart Update (unless of course a lockup doesn't occur :rolleyes: ), I can run some more focused tests to see if I can figure out what is going on.
Well, I couldn't find a quick and easy way to disable Norton SystemWorks (imagine that!), so I ignored that and just shut down Zone Alarm. I then performed the SD smart update and it worked - no lockup! I re-enabled ZA and all was well. I am not quite ready to claim victory yet, 'cause it could have just been one of those rare updates that didn't cause a lockup. But, I am going to try this procedure from now on (much better and faster than booting into safe mode) to see if it keeps working. I obviously would still like to see this incompatibility get fixed, but I guess I can live with disabling ZA during updates.
c_edge
06-04-2007, 07:18 AM
Thats great to hear :D :D Hopefully its all good.
c_edge
Well, it looks like that last go-around was just one of those lucky updates that didn't cause a lockup for whatever reason (I guess if anyone could figure out what make 'em different, we might be able to determine what is causing my lockups). Anyway, I just ran the latest update again w/ ZA disabled, and I got locked up again. Actually, not quite as bad as before - I had an instance of IE and a Java IDE running along with Task Manager. Usually, when I get a lockup, everything is hosed - including Task Mgr not showing updates. This time, it did update the CPU usage list, and I could even switch to another app. I was able to shutdown my IDE that way, but not IE. Task Mgr eventually locked up completely, and I had to power cycle again.
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